FSR -V, O in H SP V Sloveniji???

[tornado]

Pobrano na ameriškem forumu! Kaj pa če je res?

Last Weekend we get info from Peter Schaft (vice president naviga) that the next World Championship will be in Velenje / Slovenia.
Frank Werner

[brejker]

Kaj pa če je res?

Potem pridemo navijat za naše!

[tornado]

Obvestilo iz Nizozemskega in Angleškega foruma!

OFFICIAL STATEMENT - Velenje 24.10.2013

On Thursday 24.10.2013 the Board of club DMM-Velenje held a meeting where we discussed about organization of the World Championship (WC) FSR, which was supposed to be in Velenje´s Lake (Velenje, Slovenia) in year 2014. First discussions about the preparation and organization of the WC, was represented on international race in Velenje (June 2013) to the Naviga (Peter Schaft, heads of sections FSR), the Mayor of city Velenje and club Board Society. For the fund, the Club prepared a plans and project with presentation of the organization, which was in September 2013 presented to Mayor of Velenje, which was looking forward to it. At the end remained some outstanding issues that we have tried to realize and complete in September and October 2013. UNFORTUNATELY, WE WERE NOT SUCCESSFUL!

REASONS:
- We did not acquire a competent person to lead the organizing committee and all subjects for a successful implementation. For organizing WC-2013 we need cooperation between Tourist info, Mayor of the city, Hoteliers, Camp and Club leaders.
- With a fee paid by championship participants, we will not get enough funding to be able to prepare an adequate infrastructure (postpone the pontoon, make the tribunes, regulation guardrails on the water and on land),...
- At the time is not possible to provide adequate security for swimmers and other activities taking place during this period without sufficient protective barrier. Given the current economic situation in Slovenia, as well as in our city we did not receive a sufficient number of sponsors and donators.
- Despite the fact we made great efforts, we decided to withdraw the project for organize World Championship FSR-2014.

Uros_S.

[janezm]

Rado ni treba drugih forumov brat, nas vprašaj.....
Gled same aktivnosti in pobude Schafta, da bi bilo SP v Velenju pa nekaj kronologije.

Prvi razgovori o pripravi in organizaciji svetovnega prvenstva so bili s predstavnikom Navige (Peter Schaft, vodija sekcije FSR), županom mestne občine Velenje, nekaterimi udeleženci tekmovanja ter člani UO društva izvedeni ob Mednarodnem tekmovanju za pokal MO, junija 2013. Po razgovorih je društvo pripravilo projekcijo morebitne organizacije in jo obravnavalo na UO društva, 19. 7. 2013. Projekcija je bila predstavljena tudi turistični organizaciji ter nekaterim predstavnikom turističnih zmogljivosti in bila pozitivno sprejeta. V septembru mesecu je bila projekcija predstavljena MOV (županu mestne občine, vodji urada za družbene dejavnosti, vodji TIC…), ki so predlog načelno podprli. Je pa ob predstavitvi ostalo nekaj odprtih vprašanj, ki smo jih poskušali v mesecu septembru in oktobru 2013 obrazložiti, rešiti oziroma zaključiti. Projekcija predloga organizacije je bila predstavljena ter izvedeni nekateri razgovori s potencialnimi sponzorji in donatorji. Žal neuspešno, kljub velikemu trudu posameznikov in članov UO društva. Zato je bilo v društvo sklenjeno da odstopimo od nadaljnih aktivnosti.
Društvo modelarjev "Modelar" Velenje ni uradno kandidiralo pri ZTKOS ali NAVIGI za organizacijo SP-ja.
Samo pobožne želje Schafta in nekaterih nas posameznikov so bile...

Janez

[uros.skoflek]

Pozdravljeni,
največ o trenutnih razgovorih se najde na spodaj navedenem forumu. Potrebno je le znati nekaj angleščine vendar je zaenkrat takšna situacija, da se vsi nagibajo k razdelitvi svetovnega prvenstva V ter O/H ampak vse skrbi neizbežen vsip na O in H klasi kot posledica razdelitve (veliko V tekmovalcev vozi tudi O in H dosti manj pa je tekmovalcev, ki jim je priorieta O/H ti večinoma ne vozijo V).

http://rcracingboats.yuku.com/topic/108 ... e-Slovenia

LP,
Uroš

[tornado]

Nekaj mojega razmišljanja glede organizacij SP.

Zelo pozorno sledim razpravam po vseh forumih o tej problematiki. Žal sem za kandidaturo izvedel na Ami forumu, prav tako za odpoved.
Kolikor je meni razumljeno v teh razpravah jih večina podpira delitev na FSR-V in FSR-H+FSR-O. Razlog temu so absolutno predolga prvenstva.
Prvenstva se vlečejo od 10-12 dni. Marsikdo mora za ta dogodek potrošiti lep del dopusta. Udeleži se mogoče dveh kategorij. To se pravi, da za efektivno porabljen čas same udeležbe potroši vsaj 6-8dni.
Zagovornik nedelitve je trenutno Ian, ki pa ima svojo računico, kot jo pač imajo in jo bodo imeli vsi tisti, ki trgujejo in od tega živijo. Logično jim je, da imajo čimveč potencialnih kupcev čim bolj na in čimdlje na kupu. V takšnem razmišljanju jih popolnoma razumem.
Druga stvar je kakšen interes za razvlačevanje prvenstva imajo sami organizatorji. Normalno je, da je lažje pridobiti sponzorje, če se nekaj dogaja dalj časa in da je medijsko čimbolj odmevno.

Ob pregledu prejšnega prvenstva je udeležba tekmovalcev v kategorijah FSR-O in FSR-H zelo številčno primerljiva z skupino FSR-V. Mislim, da se nekaj imen res podvaja v vseh kategorijah. Večinoma so to tekmovalci, ki so nekako ''materijano'' vezani na ta hobi. Bodisi so tovarniški vozniki ali pa trgovci.

Če zadevo prenesem v naše okolje, bo večina tekmovalcev za delitev. Previdevam, da V-jašev ne zanimajo O in H tekme in obratno. Še manj pa da bi zaradi tega morali biti vezani na nek prostor 5-6dni!

Moje mišlenje, delitev tekem z max. dolžino 5dni celotnega prvenstva, kot predlaga Andy Berta.

[uros.skoflek]

Da Tornado, Andrasz Berta je res dobro napisal glede razdelitve ter terminsko razdelil prvenstvo (nenazadnje imajo nekaj izkušenj s prvenstvi), če pa pogledaš kaj je napisal Folkosn bo jasno na kaj bi tudi sam želel opozoriti in sicer, da je v času, ko je bila udeležba v H/O klasi tik pred propadom je večina V-jevcev prevzela odgovornost ter pričela tekmovati tudi s temi modeli in izpostavlja, da zelo upa na to, da nebi razdelili prvenstva istočasno pa V-jevci prenehajo tekmovati v H/O to bi pomenilo polom teh dveh klasa.
Čeprav Folkson razlaga da bo po tem predlogu občutno prevladovala "V-klasa" (govorim seveda samo o udeležbi na svetovnih prvenstvih) se lahko zgodi tudi obratno, da pride do zatona V-klase in vsi pričnejo tekmoati samo v H/O.
Vsekakor razdelitev pomeni zaton vsaj ene izmed treh kategorij vsaj takšno je moje mnenje ampak so si pri Navigi dolgo časa zatiskali oči pred takšnimi problemi.

Zakaj se je najprej razvedelo iz tujih forumov pomeni, da imajo bolj razdelano mrežo surferjev po internetu mi iz kluba smo morali dati odgovor na Navigo kar smo tudi naredili v kratkem po tem, pa smo to napisali tudi na naš forum kot uradno stališče DMM-Velenje.
spremljajte nas tudi na facebooku:
https://www.facebook.com/fsr.velenje

LP,
Uroš

[janezm]

Rad bi dopolnil razpravo Radota in Uroša "Zelo pozorno sledim razpravam po vseh forumih o tej problematiki. Žal sem za kandidaturo izvedel na Ami forumu, prav tako za odpoved", da DMMV ni nikoli kandidiral za SP.

Z Schafom smo se pogovarjali o predlogu ter seveda veliko tekmovalcev je bilo za to in so dajali pobude, da Velenje organizira SP. Ni pa bila podana kandidatura...samo pogovori so bili in pripravljen projekt (tudi finančno ovrednoten). Pa seveda korektno in pravočasno rečeno, da se ne izzide.

Po drugi strani pa je še veliko članic Navige, ki niso nikoli organizirali SP... žogica je pri njih, da servirajo....Kar poglejte koliko držav je sploh organiziralo SP, če se ne motim samo 1/3 ....

Pa še o razmišljanju Andras Berte ni novo. Peter Schaft bo moral nekaj narediti oz. odločiti oz. dati pobudo članicam Navige. Če bo čakal ne bo nič iz tega ... sploh pa če bo bral forume, kjer veliko debatirajo "v večini tisti" ki nikoli niso organizirali SP ali pa sploh ne gredo na SP.

[uros.skoflek]

A je že kdo kaj izbrskal kje bo če bo svetovno prvenstvo 2014 (Tornado ti si najbolj aktiven na tujih forumih)?

[tornado]

A je že kdo kaj izbrskal kje bo če bo svetovno prvenstvo 2014 (Tornado ti si najbolj aktiven na tujih forumih)?

Jaz nisem nikjer nič zasledil!
Sicer pa kako naj se jaz kot udeleženec vaških-piknik tekem sploh zanimam za tako prominentna tekmovanja.

[uros.skoflek]

Ja Tornado za Velenje si že zvedel na Ameriškem forumu,...hehehehehehehe

[tornado]

DaveMarles, on 18 Dec 2013 - 11:43 AM, said:

The Naviga World Champs 2014 will be held in Dessau Germany for classes FSRV, FSRO, FSRH. ( monos, hydros/riggers, V boats)

I am told that country invites will be sent out soon.

Ma tile amerikance pa res vse prvi vedo!

[Yeon]

Rado motiš se

Facebook je že včeraj vedel!

Lp. Leon

[uros.skoflek]

As long there is no official statement from Nauticus or Naviga that confirms that the 2014 WC will be held in Dessau it is so far, just a rumor!
ali po Slovensko:
ZA ENKRAT SO TO LE GOVORICE SAJ NAVIGA TEGA ŠE NI POTRDILA PRAV TAKO NE ORGANIZATOR.

[Yeon]

Facebook ima nove informacije!!!!

At all FSR-Driver National and Internatiinal...
Waiting is over .
We have bad news and good news.
Bad news: the Nauticus voted with NO to host the WC 2014.
Good news: there will be the FSR-World Championship 25.July till 10th of August 2014 in Dessau !!!
We will found a new German Association only for FSR-Driver and also a World wide New Federation called "FSR-World" only for FSR-Driver.
YES, there will be a World Championship in Dessau 2014 !!!
In a very short time we will have the Homepage with the Invitation and all further Information that you'll need to know.
Bye
Martina and Jörg

[tornado]

No, še z več tolmačenja:

First the bad news. Naviga will not have a World Championships in 2014. Apparently, one person has been the stumbling block This is the president of the German Federation who is also the president of Naviga. Today Naviga held a vote and it was voted down.

Now the good news. I was phoned by Jorg Banaszak today to tell me there will be a World Champs in Dessau 2014. This will be run by a new organisation called FSR WORLD which will be forming very soon to be run by well known racers/organisers worldwide.
The Championship will be formally advertised tomorrow. This is totally separate to Naviga but run under existing Naviga rules and FSR-O, FSR-H and FSR-V will be run. This will start with FSR-O and FSR-H the first week and 2nd week FSR-V. Arrival at Dessau earliest is Friday 25th July. Racing etc starts Monday 28th July and finishes the weekend of 10th August. Camping around the lake as before.
There are many details to be ironed out but these will be forthcoming in the next 2 to 3 months but this is definitely going ahead.

I am sure we will all be happy to hear that the facilities at Dessau are being improved with approx 2 million Euro being spent by the owners on a new restaurant and shower/ toilet facilities and general site improvements.

Regards, Dave

Še moje zelo osebno razmišljanje ob tem tekstu zgoraj.
Upam, da bodo članice Naviga v bodoče dobro razmislile koga bodo postavili na čelo organizacije.
V kolikor je to človek, ki nima posluha za tovrstno dejavnost, ne moreš od njega pričakovati razumevanja in podpore.
G. Dieter Matysik (presednik NAVIGA) je očino bolj ljubitelj maketarstvo kot hitrih in ropotajočih modelov.

[JozeS]

NAVIGA se zbuja:

http://www.naviga.org/index.php/en/news ... -statement

Na strani no.2 je angleščina.

LP,J.

[uros.skoflek]

ZDRAVO,
PO POGOVORU S PREDSEDNIKOM SEKCIJE POSREDUJEM DOPIS IN PROSIM ZA VAŠA STALIŠČA KER LE TAKO LAHKO DAMO IZJAVO V OKVIRU ZVEZE.

LP,
UROŠ
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Statement from Ian Folkson
Naviga Group Leader FSRV

This Statment is regarding the mess that has been made of a FSR V H&O championships for 2014
During Dessau in 2012 the section had an offer from Dessau to hold it again but I was told by Nauticus at the time they were not interested to hold it again. No other county came foreward with a venue for a mixed championship but we had interest from countries to hold the FSRV only. (Remember Dessau came in at the last minute to help out Naviga with combined championships)
I asked Peter Schaft many times after Hungary 2010 if we could ask for countries to hold a split championship as no one offered to do one for all classes. I was told no on more than one occasion.
During the summer 2013, already late to announce where the next championships should be held, Peter asked Slovenia if they could help hold the championships. Although the club was not really interested, as they had stated from the begining of 2013, they tried to put a championships together. Unfortunatley it took a long time to get the answers from potential sponsors and in the end they had to say they could not do it.
At that point I was contacted by KMBC Spaarnwoude club, in the Netherlands, with an offer to hold the FSRV championship only in 2014. I helped them with the details they needed and they made contact with Peter Schaft who told them to get the official papers and present them to Naviga at the general meeting in November.
At the meeting an offer from the UK and Dessau in Germany were discussed both saying they would try to run a championships in 2014. I believe the offer from the Netherlands was not presented to Naviga or discussed and Naviga gave the UK 3 weeks to see what they could do. The UK could not obtain a suitable lake for a reasonable cost and asked Dessau if they could do the championships.
Dessau needed the permision of the German federation Nauticus to hold the championships but at a meeting in January Nauticus said the papers were not correct and could not approve it. So here we are again without anything in 2014.
In the last two weeks th e Netherlands kindly offered, at this late date, to hold FSRV world championships in 2014 and I helped again with the proposal. I also made a few enquiries about a possibility to organise a FSR H & O championships for 2015 somewhere else.
I had contacted the President of Naviga Dieter Matysik trying to make a case for holding a split championship. I said that if Naviga failed to do something it would leave the door open for another federation to form and so splitting the FSR world as we know.
The president was eventually convinced and thought the idea of split championships could be the answer, to save Naviga from even bigger problems. He would try to get the other members of the presidium on his side to approve it. But after two weeks and many phone calls I got the answer. We could not hold an FSR-V championship, because Peter Schaft would not agree to a split . The reason given is that the rules say that championships must include all classes!!

So there we are. I am sorry this is so long, but I wanted to put on the record what has happened, as for so long Naviga has provided everyone with so little information.
In my opinion, the President of Naviga should have overuled Peter Schaft, who is FSR leader and vice president of Naviga and got at least part of the championships this year. As there is nothing in 2014 and they have not anounced what they intend to do for any other year they have left themselves open to other federations starting and diluting our sport.
I would like the opinions of all memeber countries of naviga on what they feel should be done now and if I was not correct in what I tried to do let me know.
Please circulate this to every one you know in the FSR world so we can get feedback on what should be done now.
Ian

[janezm]

Predsednik Navige je včeraj zopet nekaj napisal, beri spodaj je pa tudi na web strani naviga.org.

Information aus dem Präsidium
Information from the Presidium

Es gibt keine Weltmeisterschaft FSR 2014. Die NAVIGA mußte absagen. Das bedauern wir sehr. Slovenien hat sehr spät abgesagt. Das war unser
Problem. In Dessau ist eine gute Organisation bis heute nicht gesichert. Herr Banaszak hat keine Dokumente fĂĽr eine Organisation vorgelegt. Es gibt nun
einen neuen Weg. Es wird 2015 in Deutschland eine NAVIGA Weltmeisterschaft FSR geben. FĂĽr alle Klassen. Die Weltmeisterschaft wird in einer kĂĽrzere Zeit als bisher
sein. Das ist möglich. Es ist nicht gut einen neuen Verband zu gründen. Das teilt unseren Sport in zwei Gruppen. Der FSR Sport wird unter dem Dach der Weltorganisation
NAVIGA bleiben.

There is no world championship FSR 2014. The NAVIGA had to cry off. We regret this very much. Slovenien has cried off very late. This was our
problem. In Dessau a good organisation is not protected till this day. Mr. Banaszak has presented no documents for an organisation. Now there is a
new way. There will be in 2015 in Germany a world championship NAVIGA FSR. For all classes. The world championship will be in a shorter time than up to now.
This is possible. It is not to be founded well one new federation. This divides our sport into two groups. The sport FSR will remain under the roof of the world-wide
organisation NAVIGA.

NAVIGA Presidium
Dieter Matysik

Pa še moj komentar tem oz. tudi ostalim dabatam na raznih forumih. Kar se tiče SP v 2014 v Velenju vam je tako poznano kako in kaj je bilo. Velenčani smo poskušali ampak se ni izšlo, razlogi so vam poznani. Ne more pa biti to vzrok, da Naviga tako pozno reagira in šele tri mesece po zasedanju daje izjave, stališča itd.
Naša FSR podkomisija mora dati neko skupno stališče. Uroš je vas pozval, prav je da date Offshorovci svoje stališče okoli Navige-FSR in WM v prihodnje. Upam da se boste odzvali čim hitreje in podali stališče.
Sam se konkretno ne zavzemam, da se naredi neko novo združenje, saj nas bo to razdružilo, pa Naviga ima že kar dolgo tradicijo. Treba je sprejeti odločitev nap. že enkrat razdeliti V in H/O ter tako WM narediti časovno krajše. To bo spremljivejše za organizatorje, tekmovalce ter tudi prebivalce kjer poteka tekmovanje (hrup).

[tornado]

V zadnjem času se je kar precej zakuhalo okrog prireditev in organizatorjev SP.
Vsi, ki smo se teh dogajanj udeležili poznamo problematiko.
Tekmovalci kategogorij FSR-O (vsaj tisti, ki smo se tekem udeleževali) smo mnenja da :
- organizacija SP mora ostati pod okriljem NAVIGA
- tekme FSR-V, FSR-O in FSR-H naj bodo združene na eni tekmi, razdelejne na trajanje max 7dni. To pomeni, da bi se izmenjaje pričenjali z kategorijami FSR-V in FSR-O in H.

[uros.skoflek]

Rado če te prav razumem bi potem ostalo tako kot je do sedaj eno tekmovanje vsako po maximalno 1-teden z izmenjajočimi začetki?

[tornado]

Točno tako.

[uros.skoflek]

Pozdralvjeni,
očitno je z Navigo vsaj kar se tiče FSR konec saj potekajo intenzivni pogovori z UIM (ali v Italiji FIM), ki so kot zveza za motošport na vodi in so prav tako svetovna organizacija. V okviru te bi se odprla sekcija FSR-World, v kateri bi bili FSR-V,H/O in bi imeli delovanje znotraj te zveze "UIM". Da je temu tako prilagam pogovor med Jorgom, predlagateljem ustanovitve zveze FSR-World in Ianom Folksonom, ki prav tako predlaga zamenjavo zveze Navige z UIM prav tako pa je z FIM v navezi Mauro... V okviru svetovne zveze UIM smo že imeli svetovna prvenstva med letom 1992-1997.
TAKO TOREJ NAŠA SEKCIJA PA NE VEM VEČ ČE ŠE SPADA POD ZVEZO ZA TEHNIČNO KULTURO BOLJ SE MI ZDI DA BI POTEMTAKEM SPADALI POD AMZS ALI PA AŠ2000, ki so organizacije v tem okviru.

spletna stran UIM:
http://www.uimpowerboating.com/vsite/vt ... em,00.html

Statement from Ian Folkson on Facebook.
"Jorg and I had a good meeting last night and we both want to see FSR continue. I am talking to the UIM to see how it might be possible to belong to them as they are worldwide. As long as overall control stays with FSR racers. If their reply is ok then further talks will take place and maybe one strong worldwide federation will be formed UIM/FSR-World"


ali je vaš predlog še vedno enak saj mislim, da bo vse šlo v to smer če je kot predlagatelj zamenjave tudi predsednik sekcije FSR-V pri Navigi?